Australia's bid for the 2018 or 2022 World Cup

[dibo]

tl;dr

This, with the disclaimer that had it been someone other than Jesse Fink I might have bothered.

 

[Jesus]

Definately should have a big disclaimer that it is fink, so as not to waste our time

 

[midfielder]

A fair go thats all.... HMMmmmmmmm

http://www.townsvillebulletin.com.au/article/2010/01/23/109335_news.html

Give Townsville a 'fair go' at World Cup

JOHN ANDERSEN

January 23rd, 2010

A FAIR go is all that soccer's World Cup bid for Townsville deserves.

A 'fair go'. These are the two simple words that come to mind when Cowboys' executive director Peter Parr talks about the massive redevelopment work that would have to be undertaken at Dairy Farmers Stadium in order to accommodate huge crowds at the World Cup.

Suffice to say that after expressing serious reservations about the World Cup coming to Townsville in early December, Mr Parr is not exactly numero uno pin-up boy in some circles in Townsville at the moment.

Townsville people are no different from people anywhere else in Australia in that they hate to see someone not being given a 'fair go'. Right now there is a perception in this city that soccer, in its bid for a World Cup berth in Townsville, is not getting a fair go.

WHAT DO YOU THINK?
HAVE YOUR SAY BELOW

Think of soccer as the new kid that has just turned up in the schoolyard. He's nervous, doesn't know anyone and then out of the shadows comes the hulking, great schoolyard bully, Rugby League. He grabs the new kid, shoves him to the ground and grinds his face into the dirt.

This may be harsh, but it backgrounds a growing perception in Townsville that Rugby League is using its ample muscle to dislodge the World Cup bid and that talk of disruptions to NRL games and impacts on Cowboys' revenues are smokescreens designed to protect the code from losing player recruits and fans to soccer.

Peter Parr, though, won't have a bar of this. He is a man caught between a rock and the proverbial hard place in that he has to be seen, as a genuine meat-pie eating, sports-mad Aussie, to be wanting soccer to come here, but at the same time as executive director of the Cowboys he is responsible for the club's bottom line. He has to look out for the Cowboys and ensure that the club survives the financial turbulence expected to come its way via World Cup soccer.

Standing where he is in the glare of the media spotlight he is an easy mark and taking pot shots at him is as easy as shooting turtles in a tank. But, as every fair shooter knows, shooting tank turtles isn't sport, it's slaughter.

Peter Parr is keen to be seen wanting the World Cup to come to Townsville and does not want to be painted as someone who is running a covert campaign to derail the soccer bid. He says there is nothing he would like more than to find a way for the Football Federation of Australia to win its bid for the World Cup and for Dairy Farmers to be one of the host stadiums.

''I'm not against the World Cup. I have never said I am against the World Cup. It's the biggest sporting event in the world, but I am worried about the disruption and revenue loss to the Cowboys over two or three years.

''If the stadium goes to 40,000 seats that (building) work would have to be done in the lead-up to the Confederation Cup,'' he said.

''If the World Cup does come here I'd like to know how much disruption there will be and who would be responsible for the ongoing costs of the (expanded) stadium.''

Peter Parr said he was fearful that Cowboys home games would have to be suspended for the two years while the stadium was being redeveloped and that the NRL might have to suspend competition.

''I understand the enormous benefit to Townsville of having the World Cup, but one of the key performance indicators for me, or whoever is doing the job at the Cowboys, is incoming revenue. We don't want the long-term viability of the Cowboys affected and would like to know if we will be compensated if we are affected,'' he said.

''We are worth $70 million a year to the Townsville economy. While the World Cup  would bring a lot of money into the Townsville economy, we like to think that we play our part as well. We are trying to protect our back.''

Cynics might argue that Peter Parr is just trying to stop a whole bunch of Townsville kids from rushing off to join soccer clubs should the World Cup bandwagon start rolling into town. Rugby League is big business and it could be ventured that the NRL at the national level, while saying it has nothing against Australia hosting a soccer World Cup, will do what it has to do to protect itself from losing ground to the world's biggest sporting event.

Mr Parr said he would like to see a solution to the dilemma of having Dairy Farmers Stadium in a state of redevelopment for two to three years.

''I would like to work with whoever we have to, to ensure there is minimal disruption to the stadium. There may be some simple and adequate solutions, but so far these have not been provided to me. If I can get these (solutions) no-one will hear me speak out about the World Cup. I don't want to be the fly in the ointment, but I have a duty as executive officer of a community-owned organisation to ensure we are well protected,'' he said.

Mr Parr appears genuine in his desire to have the World Cup played here, but is adamant he doesn't want the Cowboys put to the financial sword.

No matter how genuine his words, no matter how persuasive his argument, the one principle that will continue to ride shotgun on the World Cup stagecoach as it rattles and rolls towards Townsville is the principle of the 'fair go'.

Henry Lawson, Banjo Paterson, Noel Pearson, Weary Dunlop, Fred Hollows and Peter Lalor all fought (Noel Pearson is still fighting) in their own way for a 'fair go' for their fellow Australians: Lawson, Paterson and Pearson through their writings on relevant social issues; Dunlop and Hollows by going to extraordinary lengths in extraordinary circumstances to help the sick; Lalor and the other heroes raised the Eureka flag at Bakers Hill at Ballarat in 1854 in a fight that won a 'fair go' for miners.

You could argue, too, that sports-loving North Queenslanders and the pubs, clubs motels and hotels and tourist operators here in Townsville want a fair go when it comes to the World Cup.

People came in the thousands for the V8 Supercars last year. They came here for the Rugby World Cup in 2003. They come here for Cowboys' home games and they will come en masse for World Cup soccer.

But, are we that insular, that parochial that we are prepared to deprive Townsville of this spectacle, this opportunity to promote itself and the wider region on tens of millions of television screens that will be tuned in around the world?

Is that a 'fair go' for Townsville? Is it a fair go for soccer, which, just like Rugby League, has a national playing side, the North Queensland Fury, based here in Townsville.

Doesn't the Fury deserve a fair go? The people of North Queensland have always given the Cowboys a fair go, even when the boys have been bogged to their bellies in slump mud and you needed a telescope to see the light at the end of the tunnel.

North Queensland, no matter what, has always been there, giving them a fair go. The 'fair go' is something that Australians hold dear to their hearts. It embodies so much that is Australian and sums us up as a nation that is always prepared to give and to understand and to act with kindness when kindness is what is needed.

If there is one defining thing about the Australian character it is the principle of the 'fair go'. Giving people, giving underdogs another chance, giving them the opportunity to prove themselves and to get ahead and make something of themselves. The opposite of course is to block, to impede, to stop them from growing and getting ahead.

The 'fair go' principle is what makes Australia the country it is today. It's what makes us take in the less fortunate from far away, war-torn and tyranised lands. They come over in their leaky boats, crossing oceans and borders and we take them in. If they deserve it, we give them a 'fair go', the chance to get ahead.

Australians give all sorts of people a fair go. We gave Bob Hawke a fair go, despite all of his misdemeanours in and out of The Lodge. We gave Rugby League football giant Andrew Johns a fair go when he 'fessed up to using drugs. We gave Paul Hogan a fair go when he pulled up his Crocodile Dundee roots and moved to America.

We gave Shane Warne so many fair goes we nearly ran out of them (and we'll probably have to give him some more). Ditto Andrew Symonds. It might be done grudgingly, but in the rare times that New South Wales has won a State of Origin Series fair and square we give the cockroaches a fair go.

Peter Parr says that if he didn't express his concerns about the World Cup publicly he wouldn't be doing his job.

He said the 'fair go' principle would apply to the World Cup.

''But should we do it at the expense of our own competition? If the (disruption) was only for the length of the World Cup for four to six weeks, I don't think anyone would have any drama. But there is potential there for it to be a major disruption for quite a while,'' he said.

Peter Parr has his own unique problems. The issue of the stadium redevelopment is not a small one and will have to be resolved so that the NRL competition can go ahead. The financial cost to the Cowboys could be huge and the club would have to be compensated.

There's hardly anyone who doesn't want World Cup soccer to come to Townsville. It would be the biggest, most exciting sporting event to ever hit town. Right now there is one man caught in the middle, between that rock and a hard place. His name is Peter Parr and he's given an assurance that, just as long as it doesn't sink the Cowboys, he'll do what he can to ensure the World Cup comes to Townsville.

Just like everyone else we've given a 'fair go', Peter Parr deserves one, too.

 

[midfielder]

Europeans HMmmm looks like as we all knew it's only 2022 we have a chance in ...

http://www.theworldgame.com.au/australia/euros-scupper-aussie-2018-bid-282727

Euros scupper Aussie 2018 bid
26 January 2010 | 16:13 - SBS: Philip Micallef
ARTICLE

FIFA president Sepp Blatter revealed that he has had talks with UEFA about a deal that would restrict bids for the 2018 World Cup to Europe.

Blatter said in Madrid after a meeting with Spanish prime minister Jose Luis Rodriguez Zapatero that he could see Europe being the sole candidate for the 2018 World Cup.

Australia has put its hand up for the 2018 and/or 2022 events.

"There is a movement at the moment among the various candidates that in the end it would be a good solution ... if the candidates for 2018 would only be those from Europe," he told a press conference.
"It's not been finally decided but it's the idea also to make the work of FIFA easier and especially that of the executive committee.
"It would also possibly make the work of the different organisations applying for the World Cup easier."

Blatters statement would have raised a few eyebrows at Football Federation Australia headquarters, especially since the FFA has not heard from the world governing body on the matter.

As far as we are concerned we are bidding for the 2018 and 2022 World Cups and that has not changed, an FFA spokesman said.

Blatter confirmed that he had talks with UEFA president Michel Platini about the proposed deal.
England and Russia are bidding separately for the two events while Spain and Portugal and Belgium and the Netherlands are presenting joint bids.

The non-European countries who are bidding for the two tournaments are Australia, USA, Japan and Indonesia while Korea Republic and Qatar are only interested in 2022.

FIFAs executive committee will announce the hosts of the two tournaments in December.
Blatters vague comments have raised several questions, such as:

Who are the parties involved in the proposed deal?

Is this a plot by Europe to freeze out its competitors and make sure it gets the World Cup for the first time since 2006?

After this years event in South Africa, the worlds greatest sporting event will go to Brazil in 2014 and there is a feeling that the European football community would never accept a situation whereby they miss out on three successive World Cups.

 

[midfielder]

Martin Smith from Foxs writes  Harper opinion on the same story and IMO well written...

http://www.foxsports.com.au/story/0,8659,26637835-5019088,00.html

Is Sepp Blatter moving the goalposts for 2018 FIFA World Cup bid process?
By Martin Smith
foxsports.com.au
January 26, 2010
Fox Sports football commentator Andy Harper suspects FIFA president Sepp Blatter wants to change the World Cup bidding process to ensure the 2018 finals are held in Europe.

What I would suggest is that if they are going to change the goalposts this late in the piece ... there would have to be some political sweeteners in it.

Andy Harper

The Fox Sports football commentator ponders what Blatter's comments mean for Australia's dual bid. Blatter told a press conference in Madrid that he was seeking to strike a deal with UEFA president Michel Platini that would guarantee the 2018 FIFA World Cup finals were played in Europe.

While the move has Blatter's support, it would have to be approved by a majority of the FIFA Executive, which comprosises representatives from around the world.

Harper said that such a deal, were it struck, would be "disappointing".

And he wondered if FIFA could make the change at such a point in the bidding procedure, given that Australia and four other non-European nations had each already made a formal bid to host the 2018 World Cup finals.

"I'm not sure how they'd do it, I'm not even sure they'd be allowed to do it - but of course that would depend on FIFAs own statutes," he told foxsports.com.au.

"What I would suggest is that if they are going to change the goalposts this late in the piece - and it's pretty late in the piece, well over halfway through the whole bidding process - there would have to be some political sweeteners in it.

"All that would be going on behind the scenes. That's where the politics of all this kicks in."

Football Federation Australia officials have already stated a "business as usual" stance in the wake of Blatter's comments, but Harper said that he would be surprised if FFA wasn't seeking clarification from FIFA about how the comments affect Australia's bid.

"I'd be very surprised if there wasn't some clarification being sought on the basis of the comments that seem to be suggesting that FIFA are considering making it a 'European-only' need to apply," Harper said.

"No one needs to do anything yet, until that's clarified.

"But I'm sure the FFA are seeking that clarification, as they should."

Harper, meanwhile, said that FFA had in chairman Frank Lowy the right man to handle the political back-and-forth of world football.

"I have never-ending faith in Frank Lowy," he said.

"I think he has proven domestically ... what a powerhouse he is, and the inroads he has made internationally speak for themselves. There is no one better for our case to be leading the charge."

Were Australia ruled out of contention to host the 2018 World Cup finals, Harper said that he could see no reason why the country couldn't host the 2022 tournament.

"Why not?" he said.

"It's a highly political game but, outside the politics, Australia has organsied itself very well. It has impressed people very well, and Australia has already, over the years, sold itself before FFA decided to bid for the World Cup.

"It's a country people know and like, and it's a country that people trust."

 

[dibo]

Just makes it clearer who our friends have to be. We are relying on picking the right horse for 18 and hoping we get a good chunk of their votes. Big problem with 22 is several additional countries bidding for 22 only as against the 18/22 bids.

Dodginess like this is no surprise, what would concern me would be if we saw he FFA or worse Lowy himself coming out and bitching - that's the clearest sign we've just been f**ked sideways. The FFA may have already known about this and factored it in to negotiations with voters and rival bids.

 

[Jaza_SFC]

You'd have to be more than a bit concerned for the sensibility of the bid if they weren't prepared to be blocked out of 2018 ...

 

[dibo]

You'd have to be more than a bit concerned for the sensibility of the bid if they weren't prepared to be blocked out of 2018 ...

That too.

 

[midfielder]

Question without notice.... Can we at this late stage redo our bid and go for co hosting rights with Indonesia... 

 

[Arabmariner]

Question without notice.... Can we at this late stage redo our bid and go for co hosting rights with Indonesia... 

I think they're against co-hosting now aren't they ? (FIFA)

Behind closed doors I'd be very surprised if the FFA weren't planning all along for 2022.

If the 2018 WC goes anywhere bar europe that would be at least 16 years between WC's over there.That will never happen imo.

 

[pjennings]

FIFA is still dominated by UEFA, but that will not last forever. Europe will still be the dominate federation for hosting the World Cup in years to come - just not to the same extent.

Consider the scenario where Europe got 2018 and Australia got 2022.

If that happened you would think that USA would be sentimental favourites for 2026 tp coincide with 250 years of American Independence (World Cup Final July 4, 2026), Uruguay will be 2030, 100 years after first World Cup then back to Europe in 2034 - again a 16 year break.

 

[pjennings]

http://www.fiveaa.com.au/Audio_Kate-Ellis-on-Australia-s-World-Cup-Bid_95781

Kate Ellis on 5AA on Wednesday - nearly half an hour. Well worth a listen.

 

[dibo]

Question without notice.... Can we at this late stage redo our bid and go for co hosting rights with Indonesia... 

How would that help, even ignoring FIFA's views on co-hosting?

 

[Jesus]

Question without notice.... Can we at this late stage redo our bid and go for co hosting rights with Indonesia... 

How would that help, even ignoring FIFA's views on co-hosting?

Massive full stadiums of 100k, as well as commercial viability of australia and europe I presume.

Would be a great thing for asian intergration but cant see it happening.

 

[pjennings]

TBH - even if it was not part of the original bid - I could see FIFA being open to a group being based in Jakarta.

 

[midfielder]

Question without notice.... Can we at this late stage redo our bid and go for co hosting rights with Indonesia... 

How would that help, even ignoring FIFA's views on co-hosting?

Have been reading some overseas blogs on the WCB most say Australia is in with a great chance if we can get through the early rounds But with the Asian vote spilt 4 ways and with Qatar having brought the African vote to get to the final 3 could be a lot harder than it looks from afar

But with a joint bid with Indonesia, the Asian vote may come our way much earlier in the process and being the worlds largest Muslim nation  it is argued that the African vote to Qatar may not be a solid as it currently is.

Sorta of insurance and Indonesia only have one stadium so we loose only one of the eight groups and a semi final

 

[midfielder]

These are the numbers that really matter in getting through the first rounds The 24 members of the FIFA executive

Made up of El Presidente (Honest John he is called ERrrrrr) + the following:
(a) CONMEBOL vice-president (1) members (2)
(b) AFC vice-president (1) members (3)
(c) UEFA vice-presidents (2) members (5)
(d) CAF vice-president (1) members (3)
(e) CONCACAF vice-president (1) members (2)
(f) OFC vice-president (1) member ()
(g) the four British vice-president (1) member ()
Associations

You need 13 delegates to win the bid.
The way I see it.
Qatar might feel confident in sewing up the 4 African votes and 2-3 Asian votes.
USA will get the 3 Concacaf and 3 Conmebol votes
Aussies will be hoping we get the European vote. Otherwise the bid is in trouble.

Now why Qatar will not win the final bid ... but will save face and not go out to early ... is

Based on the 64 games played and minimum required stadium size the WC as an event has at least 2.46million tickets yet the population is around 1mill. No country that small can support those requirements. No country that small can arrange transport and travel for an extra 2million visitors that would be needed

Also temps in the Gulf regularly reach mid to high 50s in the summer. I saw it reach 62 once!. You cant concieve of how much hotter than 40 deg that is unless youve experienced it. Sitting still is stressful and exhausting. Playing worldcup football is not even imaginable.

The idea of airconditioning a large stadium in these sorts of conditions is a myth. Just because a couple of Sheiks have the typical gulf attitude of dont bother me with details , just make it happen..doesnt mean it will.

I just cant see how staging a WC cup there is even possible let alone desireable.

 

[midfielder]

Another way of looking at the data..

Say we get to the final four of the voting with nations left in being;- Qatar, US, Japan, Australia are left ( a big assumption BTW)

This is the  picture

Confederation Votes..  Aus US . Japan . Oatar                     

Oceania1 .1
CONMEBOL ..3 ....3
CONCACAF 3....3
CAF .....4 .....4
AFC ...4 ..2.2
Sub Total 15 .1....62...6
UEFA .7
British Special ...........1
El Presidente ,...1
Total .24

Assume UEFA gets us to the final three now
Confederation Votes..  Aus US . . Oatar                     

Oceania1 .1
CONMEBOL ..3 ....3
CONCACAF 3.....3
CAF .....4 ...4
AFC ...4 2.2
Sub Total 15 .3...6....6
UEFA .7
British Special.............1
El Presidente ...1
Total ..24

Meaning without UEFA votes we are sunk... also say we make the final two and Qatar decide if Australia win Asia will not get the WC for some time ... but if we loose Asia should get it in 2026 .. so CAF may vote for US ... meaning US have 10 votes without Asia, UEFA & Oceania..


I guess what I am saying is the buying of the AFC vote has changed the entire picture...

 

[Jesus]

I dont think because qatar paid to lobby at the conference, that they can be assumed to have the backing of the delegates sown up.

There is no reason why we should not be able to pick up votes in europe especially if they get 2018.

Would be great for the region to have 1 or 2 stadiums in indonesia used for our bid, would also massively bump up crowd numbers

 

[midfielder]

In Frank we trust ... from Obie Wan himself ... note the yacht in Greece Go Frank ...

http://www.smh.com.au/sport/football/world-cup-will-be-here-lowy-says-20100129-n42f.html

The Football Federation Australia chairman believes Australia will host the event in 2018 or 2022, despite FIFA's misgivings, writes Sebastian Hassett.

FIFA may favour a European contender to host the 2018 World Cup, but Football Federation Australia chairman Frank Lowy remains confident Australia will win the hosting rights for the tournament, or that which follows in 2022.

In an interview with The Australian Financial Review magazine, Lowy reaffirmed his determination to bring the world's biggest event to Australia, and his belief that it was anything but the pipe dream some cynics believe. After spending the majority of his business career turning Westfield into one of the world's most powerful and profitable shopping centre chains, Lowy is now channelling the bulk of his energies into bringing the World Cup to Australia, a feat that would easily be the crowning glory in a life filled with corporate success.

While the doubters continue to deride Australia's bid, Lowy himself is steadfast that Australia will emerge from the bidding announcement, set down for December, with one of the two editions up for grabs. ''I don't want to underestimate the task, it is enormous. But if I didn't believe we could win, then I would not be doing this,'' Lowy says. ''I know the scene and I know the people, and I think we have a more than reasonable chance. We will get one of them.''

Lowy, who will be 87 at the time of the 2018 World Cup, said that hosting the tournament was all about ''nation building'', and that it had many similarities with the Olympics - except that it was ''10 times bigger''.

Regardless of the spruiking, Lowy knows that the challenge to win the hosting rights boils down to one simple equation: getting more than half of the 24 delegates on FIFA's Executive Committee to vote for Australia.

''This is international sport and diplomacy mixed together. And to win votes from 13 members out of 24 is a horrendous task,'' he says. ''All of these members are long-standing, and they all have their alliances and likes and dislikes, so it's an uphill battle.

''There is not that much business orientation, although it requires business acumen, [deciding] where [the World Cup] should be held and how to produce the most profit from it and so on.

''While FIFA management have that uppermost in their mind, with respect to the executive committee, there are lots of other considerations; legitimate considerations but other considerations.''

Lowy believes one of the biggest strengths on Australia's bid is their proximity to Asia, a market with huge interest in football but one that remains relatively untapped in terms of exposure and interaction.

''Now is the time for the game to gain dominance in Asia, and we can offer that,'' Lowy says. ''And, financially, we believe we can offer FIFA just as good as they can get anywhere else and, I think, even better.''

Another man with plenty of experience in the sphere of diplomacy and sport, Australian Olympic Committee president John Coates, revealed how he introduced Lowy to Sepp Blatter, the FIFA president, in Athens - laying the foundation of a close friendship.

''When [Lowy] became chairman, I arranged for them to meet, and they just hit it off,'' Coates says. ''Frank then bought [his super yacht] Ilona to Greece for the 2004 Olympics and put on a lunch for all the FIFA delegates. So they certainly know who he is, and that helps.''

Coates believes the political wheeling and dealing at this year's World Cup in South Africa, which starts in June, will be instrumental in deciding where the two tournaments up for bidding will end up.

''The real action will be at the [2010 World Cup],'' he said. ''It's an opportunity to get to know the 24 people who are going to vote, and for them to get to know you.''