Mariners home final in Sydney

[Pete]

imagine the train to stadium australia for a mariners vs newcastle grand final. rough.

Oh, that would be hmmm, how should I say it, err interesting?The trip back would be worse tho, particularly for those supporting the losing team. And the possibility of fights, arguments etc. - a plenty.

 

[Pete]

The fact is tho about this debate, the club has to toe the line at the end of the day.

The GF is a FFA event, and the Mariners are a franchisee holder of one of 8 licences into the HAL.

Should the FFA decide to place the GF outside of the stadium of the GF rights holder for this season, that's probably their prerogative to do so. And I bet there's something mentioned like that in the deal that the Mariners signed when they signed on for the HAL.

IF we win the right to host the GF AND the FFA comes out and says it won't be held at Bluetongue, the club will have to very diplomatic in their answer to that announcement (even tho behind the scenes they may well be seething). It would be up to supporters to lobby for a change in any such decision - and we'd have to lobby the FFA, not the Mariners.

The other issue is the expected revenue (for the FFA and the 8 HAL clubs) from a  GF at Stadium Australia (now ANZ Stadium) vs. Bluetongue.

If the FFA cops a few brickbats from the supporters for proposing a shift away from the Mariners home, they may well bend to popular response but price the tickets significantly higher to recoup the lost revenue from the lower crowd at Bluetongue. Given we have a max. capacity of 20119 and ANz is what 80K, what price do you expecta ticket to be? 4 times the expected amount?

 

[Roar_Meat]

Play your home finals at Suncorp...LOL

 

[Hagar the Horrible]

They had this problem in the NSL a few years ago. When Wollongong won the right to host the final, they were forced to play it at Parramatta Stadium.

 

[Roar_Meat]

We could just have the one leg at Suncorp...LOL

 

[Drunken Rodent]

Most other clubs are sacking coaches, disciplining players or struggling for points and look what we have to talk about. What a good problem to have...

 

[Pete]

Play your home finals at Suncorp...LOL

Why?
There's a couple of decent sized stadia within a 100k distance from Gosford eg. ANZ (Stadium Australia) and SFS.

At least at those places we wouldn't have to ship banners up a week before the game for the Stadium's 'approval', and put up with some of the most stupid minded security I've witnessed. Those idiots at Suncorp are costing you the chance of WC qualifiers I reckon, as I'm sure the FFA has heard what the stadium's security bods are like, and won't risk a Socceroos match atmosphere on people who haven't a clue about what they are supposed to do. Great stadium, shit security. 

You should, for one match, as a Roar supporter's group official, take a look at the way away supporters are treated by this idiotic mob and see the potential for a bloody disaster at the end of some match.

 

[Part_Timer]

Why?
There's a couple of decent sized stadia within a 100k distance from Gosford eg. ANZ (Stadium Australia) and SFS.

At least at those places we wouldn't have to ship banners up a week before the game for the Stadium's 'approval', and put up with some of the most stupid minded security I've witnessed. Those idiots at Suncorp are costing you the chance of WC qualifiers I reckon, as I'm sure the FFA has heard what the stadium's security bods are like, and won't risk a Socceroos match atmosphere on people who haven't a clue about what they are supposed to do. Great stadium, shit security. 

You should, for one match, as a Roar supporter's group official, take a look at the way away supporters are treated by this idiotic mob and see the potential for a bloody disaster at the end of some match.

my thoughts exactly...talk about atmosphere killing security gaurds and officials

 

[kevrenor]

..
[quote author=pete]
Those idiots at Suncorp are costing you the chance of WC qualifiers I reckon, as I'm sure the FFA has heard what the stadium's security bods are like, and won't risk a Socceroos match atmosphere on people who haven't a clue about what they are supposed to do. Great stadium, shit security. 
You should, for one match, as a Roar supporter's group official, take a look at the way away supporters are treated by this idiotic mob and see the potential for a bloody disaster at the end of some match.

my thoughts exactly...talk about atmosphere killing security guards and officials
[/quote]
Note when you read this stuff from FFA below that their thinking is different - all arse covering and talking tough. "Provide information to supporters groups" - but not consult, listen to, ask, etc!

All supporters groups should be banding together and writing to Buckley about idiot security at some grounds. They should also of course cooperate with identifying hooligans - who almost entirely shun anything as uncool as supporters groups.   


"FFA Media Release
Friday 21 December 2007
FFA Undertakes Security Review

Football Federation Australia (FFA) today announced that a formal review
of the current security standards has begun for Hyundai A-League,
International and AFC Champions League matches. 

As an important part of the review process, FFA has contracted HATAMOTO
Pty Ltd, a business resilience and security consultancy with extensive
international and national infrastructure, transport and major event
experience to review the incumbent Minimum Security Standards.  Working
closely with local State Police Commands, Security Contractors, Venue
Managers and Event Organisers, HATAMOTO will assist FFA in the audit
including identifying and implementing opportunities for improvement. 

"The growing crowds at Hyundai A-League matches have added an element to
the match day experience that is unique to our sport. In managing this
spectator growth it is pertinent for the FFA to review its security
practices across all match venue", said FFA Chief Executive Officer Ben
Buckley today. 

"While the majority of our supporters are well behaved, a small element
of the spectator base have sought to be disruptive at a limited number
of our matches. FFA wants to be clear that it will not tolerate activity
that breaches our Spectator Code of Conduct, impacts safety or spoils a
good day out for the majority of our fans at any venue. We want to
ensure that our loyal and growing fan base can come and enjoy the game
that they are passionate about in complete safety, and having mutual
respect for all those attending', Mr Buckley said. 

"This review provides an excellent opportunity to improve planning and
operational applications and the levels of consistency of the FFA
security program', Mr Buckley concluded. 

The review will examine Club practice and venue operations in Australia
and New Zealand and focus on all major components of venue security
including crowd behaviour. Information sharing with relevant Law
Enforcement Agencies, Clubs and Spectator Groups will also be a key
focus.

 

[Pete]

I actaully think this is probably a good move by the FFA. Seems they are trying to implement good minimum standards at all grounds.

Hope to see changes at places like Suncorp as a result.

The reason why the FFA hasn't consulted supporters groups about this is simple - we don't have any organisation, or peak body they can talk to.

Even in the Marinators, who would they talk to about match day security? DJ, Fish or Jeff, what about some input from Brett as well? See how fractured it is. Imagine the difficulties in getting proper representation in a set up like the Tards have!

That is why I put up that proposal about the Council of Supporters' Groups back in July or August. Until there's a formal group or council dealing with the overall approach to match day supporting, the FFA will just consult with the other parties and listen to them. Organise ourselves nationwide, and then someone can represent us to the FFA and put some views to them.

I suspect the 'information sharing' that has been mentioned in the last paragraph, will probably come down to them picking our brains to stop anti social behaviour and the Police & FFA taking the credit for any strategy devised. The security strategies will be given to us as a given package and we will be told what is expected of us as spectators and supporters.

 

[brett]

Actually Pete, the FFA could approach the Marinators Club formally through our Gosford PO Box. The Marinators Club doesn't represent all the fans but it's a good start.

Don't get caught up thinking that this will improve what is going on at Suncorp - read between the lines and you'll see that the whole thing is an anti-hooligan crackdown...

 

[~Floss~]

It'll be an ineffective hooligan crackdown, nothing more than an opportunity for organised groups like the Marinators to publicly be seen to be anti-hooliganism.

It won;t actually prevent any hooliganism because no hooligans are involved with such organised groups.... IMHO

 

[Pete]

Actually Pete, the FFA could approach the Marinators Club formally through our Gosford PO Box. The Marinators Club doesn't represent all the fans but it's a good start.

Don't get caught up thinking that this will improve what is going on at Suncorp - read between the lines and you'll see that the whole thing is an anti-hooligan crackdown...

I accept those comments Brett, but they are looking at a national strategy and as we have seen, there's different security strategies at the various Stadia. Some of it is because of local circumstances and advice from Police, probably in the absence of detailed security rules from the FFA. But some of it is just nonsense.

LATE EDIT: Instead of waiting for some letter fron the FFA, why can't the Marinators Club go to the FFA?
Is it not in the interests of the Marinators Club to be wanting to be active in a review of this nature, giving them a view from the fans' angle, and hopefully providing better conditions for the average fan when they attend matches? I wouldn't expect the FFA to look us up, nor would I expect the Mariners to give them our P.O. Box number. I'd suggest we'd have to go to them, particularly in the absence of some national supporters council.

By adopting a minimum standard we all know what is to happen and hopefully the surprise that Mr. Celery got when he turned up at Suncorp hours before the match, only to be told that a banner needed a week- before submission  , won't be sprung.

So what the Marinators believe is OK to happen at Bluetongue, may absolutely peeve another supporters group when they turn up, and vice versa when we go to their place.

I was suggesting that if there had been some peak council of the supporters' groups established, they could go to them at an earlier stage of the review, and maybe even consult with them. By having the various groups around Australia, it makes it difficult for that same process to occur, and the responses would be inconsistent with each other. Also, by consulting witha  peak council at an earlier stage, the representative on the council for the Marinators could give the Marinators Club a briefing on how things are developing and what to expect before the information is 'shared'  : with us as a completed package.

A hooligan, by nature, just couldn't give a damn about any of this process or it's outcomes. If anyone wants to stir trouble, cause some headlines, they will work some way of getting it done.

I hope they don't kill the atmosphere at the matches, nor deter/ scare fans away by any security measures they introduce.

 

[bikinigirl]

. pete i think brett means the marinators can be contacted in a formal way such as you were suggesting which would lead to a discussion with the correct person/people

. this would prevent confusion as to who is the right person and allow for an official/authorised response

 

[Pete]

Thanx for the correction Bikinigirl, modified my response.......I'm half asleep ???

 

[~Floss~]

It may not even involve any input from supporters' groups.

The "Information Sharing," as they call it, may just mean that after the review is completed they say "This is what we found" and "This is what will change".

Or they may want to get some information from supporters groups. Doesn't necessarily mean anyone is actively involved in any decision-making though.

 

[midfielder]

..
[quote author=pete]

my thoughts exactly...talk about atmosphere killing security guards and officials

Note when you read this stuff from FFA below that their thinking is different - all arse covering and talking tough. "Provide information to supporters groups" - but not consult, listen to, ask, etc!

All supporters groups should be banding together and writing to Buckley about idiot security at some grounds. They should also of course cooperate with identifying hooligans - who almost entirely shun anything as uncool as supporters groups.   


"FFA Media Release
Friday 21 December 2007
FFA Undertakes Security Review

Football Federation Australia (FFA) today announced that a formal review
of the current security standards has begun for Hyundai A-League,
International and AFC Champions League matches.  

As an important part of the review process, FFA has contracted HATAMOTO
Pty Ltd, a business resilience and security consultancy with extensive
international and national infrastructure, transport and major event
experience to review the incumbent Minimum Security Standards.  Working
closely with local State Police Commands, Security Contractors, Venue
Managers and Event Organisers, HATAMOTO will assist FFA in the audit
including identifying and implementing opportunities for improvement. 

"The growing crowds at Hyundai A-League matches have added an element to
the match day experience that is unique to our sport. In managing this
spectator growth it is pertinent for the FFA to review its security
practices across all match venue", said FFA Chief Executive Officer Ben
Buckley today. 

"While the majority of our supporters are well behaved, a small element
of the spectator base have sought to be disruptive at a limited number
of our matches. FFA wants to be clear that it will not tolerate activity
that breaches our Spectator Code of Conduct, impacts safety or spoils a
good day out for the majority of our fans at any venue. We want to
ensure that our loyal and growing fan base can come and enjoy the game
that they are passionate about in complete safety, and having mutual
respect for all those attending', Mr Buckley said. 

"This review provides an excellent opportunity to improve planning and
operational applications and the levels of consistency of the FFA
security program', Mr Buckley concluded. 

The review will examine Club practice and venue operations in Australia
and New Zealand and focus on all major components of venue security
including crowd behaviour. Information sharing with relevant Law
Enforcement Agencies, Clubs and Spectator Groups will also be a key
focus.

[/quote]

Actually very good news and maybe should be a thread all of its own, and I think they would welcome our imput.

BB has done an excellent job with this release, and if you read any of my previous comments on BB then you know I am not a fan.

First the release is after much of the heat has died down over football crowd behaviour, so it appears FFA is not pressured into doing something, it is part of plan.

Bullsh*t, when done well is to be admired, when someone bullsh*ts the bullshi*ter and in a very clever way, I tips my lid.

To explain, seemingly taking their time as indicated they appear professional. But its the timing and the way it reads that is so clever. Released just prior to Christmas so most of the media mafia are on hols so there is no time to tear apart and given the time of year will get reasonable coverage so tick timing as excellent.

Then the way it reads it counters all other arguments, like it applies to one maybe a couple of clubs, very nice, and then its only at some games,  thus putting the issue into perspective and in the hands of an independent body to report, big tick again.

IMO the best part was when BB took bad reports are turned into good news stories, BB says we have increased and growing crowds, special supporters groups, tick, tick and tick again.  So report is important to develop Spectator Code of Conduct that is a nice turn of phrase. In effect using the increased in supporters numbers as one of the main reasons for the report.

Then the lovely bit were he says, The review will examine Club practice and venue operations so he has opened up the door to explain to security types that they need to reassess as well. (Special note to Roar and Vic police who capsicum spray a 15 year old boy and then blame him)

The release has been timed for least come back and plenty of exposure, put the whole issue into its proper place, talked up the crowd number and supporter groups, opened up the door to discuss with security and police there roles within the crowd behaviour issue, and by giving it all to an independent group it have respect and credibility.

So well done BB
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

 

[Roar_Meat]

Play your home finals at Suncorp...LOL

Why?
There's a couple of decent sized stadia within a 100k distance from Gosford eg. ANZ (Stadium Australia) and SFS.

At least at those places we wouldn't have to ship banners up a week before the game for the Stadium's 'approval', and put up with some of the most stupid minded security I've witnessed. Those idiots at Suncorp are costing you the chance of WC qualifiers I reckon, as I'm sure the FFA has heard what the stadium's security bods are like, and won't risk a Socceroos match atmosphere on people who haven't a clue about what they are supposed to do. Great stadium, shit security. 

You should, for one match, as a Roar supporter's group official, take a look at the way away supporters are treated by this idiotic mob and see the potential for a bloody disaster at the end of some match.

The stadium management has just been renewed, it is now run by the bloke who used to manage Millineum Stadium in Wales and he understands football.

 

[Gen (MarinerMum)]

One thing the FFA needs to realise is that the damage done to the Mariners by moving the grandfinal has the potential to significantly reduce support, despite all their hard work at involving the community.

Just look at Rugby League - as NSW die hard code but the coasters did not take to being given Manly/Norths team.  League attendance numbers have fallen considerably since money became more important than the fan.  People have walked away.

Surely the FFA can see this or is this to a plan to rid the league of the Mariners!! 

The Mariners have gone above and beyond the expectations of the FFA & I feel that niggles lowey.  The developement of a junior base on which to develop future players, community involvement.  Heavens forbid play the game at Aussie Stadium (what an insult) & Telstra - they have stars in their eyes.

What if it were a Newcastle Mariners grandfinal.  The Franklowey Football Association should have had a plan in its foundation year not just now.  Only Sydney, Melbourne and Queensland(Brispain) have stadiums so they are the minority, smaller stadiums are the majority.

? dickheads

 

[FFC Mariner]

It will be based on $$$ and nothing else I'm afraid.

Assuming we are the "home" finalists, I would expect the venues to be along the lines of:

Bling/Tards/Scum  - ANZ Stadium (Homebush)

Qld/Adelaide - SFS

They will know that they will get > 20k for the GF so will cash in as much as they can. Its part of the franchise agreement and no amount of protest would change it I imagine.