AFL war on Football - won't work

[FFC Mariner]

My 2 bobs worth.............

Union is there for the taking I reckon. No club comp to sustain the grass roots and Super 14 has the potential to reach into 4 cities (Max). Their "international" side has probably already been superceded by the Socceroos as a brand. Their heartland is NSW & Qld. Guess where the most aggressive HAL expansion is going to be??

League is slowly killing itself with its parochialism and small minded outlook. Only propped up by News Ltd & Ch9, in time, Football will be on FTa and they will see their sponsorship base whither and die.

AFL - Long,long way ahead and no need to even try to compete right now.

Yes, all codes can coexist to a point but the battle is for sponsorship and TV ratings and that IS a finite market.

AFL can probably see the future (NRL cant/wont) and want to secure their revenue base early. Sound tactic TBH

 

[midfielder]

what are we meant to be doing then?

Dibo

You pose the one million dollar question and I would welcome any ideas you have. Read sports journalism in Melbourne and read ex AFL player or AFL follower, Sydney similar but not to the same extent.

As I said given the above it is of little value emailing or writing to media organizations or to media watch as these things have been done maybe millions of times and is just water of a ducks back.

However beyond the sports departments are the financial boffins in media companies , and in most advertising agencies there are those who wish to sell product and do research for there clients. These are key decision makers who sit behind sports departments approving budgets and spending. Sponsors financial people as well because as Australia companies become more globalized  the more they are looking to get more out of their marketing dollars.

These are the people we need to reach ..how..to reach them .will not be easy.. write, ring, ask questions, email, post not sure I am open to suggestions.

Additionally Ch 9, I am informed by the wife of a mate who works there,  has its programming approved in the US now, essentially Ch 9 executives prepare programs and budgets and they forward same to the US for approval now. Not sure about 7 & 10, but both have overseas ownership now so could be similar. How to get the word out is hard and I am sure that Frank Lowy & BB are hard at work on it.

From groups like ours helping to expose the thin veneer of over hyped AFL and in any way you can think of to reach key decision makers. Some suggestions from a group of us at a BBQ on Sunday was; key places on football forums as these do get read and maybe get sent on; owing some shares (minor investment) in media and write as shareholder concerns about poor profit results, and cheapness of football when compared; see if anyone on a from the forum works in the advertising and pass information on to them just so they know; some to anyone working in marketing or financial departments in medium to large companies, over a number of football forums.

Dibo .. any ideas are welcome look forward to yours


Cheers

Midfielder

 

[dibo]

Football needs to challenge the AFL hype ..howis the difficult. Maybe letters off to Media watch (small part at best), call talk back (helps if enough people call and call often enough).

My suggestion is to send to as many advertising agencies, Key financial people in media organisations especially the overseas owners of 7 , 9 & 10. As sports journalism in Melbourne as I see it is a AFL player who can talk and present themselves well. The same to Fox & Telstra who are major players, if enough people own shares in these companies ask question that these facts present and at key decision maker level let the facts be known. Another maybe good area is the Australia Financial Review.

In summary dont overestimate the AFL, dont underestimate the NRL,.certainly dont underestimate football products. BUT MOST IMPORTANTLEY SPREAD THE WORD ABOUT THE HYPE IN AREAS THAT HURT.

i don't think this is a good idea, and have said why not. i think football is going in the right direction and doesn't need any special campaign from the fans to advance itself - we will live or die on our own merits, not on the basis of some grassroots campaign attacking other codes. by all means say you're a football fan, but i feel there's no need to attack other codes. i don't think we need it, i don't think it will help, even if for no other reason but the simple fact that like it or not there are more of them than us right now and we do enough spinning of our own that we're hardly coming from a position of strength.

 

[adz]

oohhh that over hyped AFL is at it again... clearly it isn't as popular as they make out!

http://afl.com.au/tabid/208/Default.aspx?newsid=57899

 

[adz]

i'm not questioning the facts, i'm questioning the approach.

I'm questioning both the facts and the approach ;D

 

[midfielder]

i'm not questioning the facts, i'm questioning the approach.

I'm questioning both the facts and the approach ;D

Check my facts they the about TV ratings, I never questioned AFL crowd figures or there TV deal in fact I said

"The AFL is undoubtedly the most professionally run best connected sport in Australia, it has the biggest media deal, the most free to air, the biggest crowds. The best media, the most profitable. "

No one will ever get close to them with crowds ............. I never said otherwise.

I said they hype a lot of things when as you point out there is no great need to given their already strong position.

What I said was and asked a question if so strong and so powerful why declare war on other codes............ then I looked and found many of the AFL claims were hyped IMO and posted why.

Like the biggest TV ratings when they are not ............. I have no idea why they keep saying but here are the links if you wish to check them

http://www.thinktv.com.au//Media/Sta...07_Survey8.pdf

http://www.crikey.com.au/Media-Arts-...expansion.html

http://www.thinktv.com.au/SiteMedia/...6361a65a7d.pdf


For population figures see ABS site.

Dibo

I guess we will never agree on this but just to finish off as I see it the AFL .............. not .............. midfielder declared a war on the other codes and football was mentioned.................... all I did was look at why .............. and believe they have over hyped their claims in a number of areas........... so I believe football has the right to fight back. Maybe not in a forum............and maybe just do our thing as you suggest is the answer

 

[Jesus]

There is no need for action from the fans in this regard.

Fans have a few options they can use.
Play the games.
Go to games, at all levels. (both put money in the games pocket)
Write to papers etc asking for more coverage of the game.

There is no need to go crazy and do more. Any more is the job of the ffa, and it is likely that you hurt the cause taking other vigilante actions

 

[adz]

Check my facts they the about TV ratings...

Where have they made claims about being the top rating TV sport?
Why does it matter anyway?
Is this the only "thin veneer of over hyped AFL" you hope to expose?
What good will that do?

As I said, I like the enthusiasm, but it seems a bit off the mark. You want to sell football by saying "AFL is over hyped and football is cheap"???

Is this really how to get sponsors interested in football?

 

[midfielder]

Check my facts they the about TV ratings...

Where have they made claims about being the top rating TV sport?
Why does it matter anyway?
Is this the only "thin veneer of over hyped AFL" you hope to expose?
What good will that do?

As I said, I like the enthusiasm, but it seems a bit off the mark. You want to sell football by saying "AFL is over hyped and football is cheap"???

Is this really how to get sponsors interested in football?

Fist of all I am not trying to sell football by saying AFL is over hyped, if my post implied that then I am sorry ........... but was never my intent.

What does it matter anyway ................ well if you say something long enough and loud enough people actually believe you and if what they are saying indirectly affects football then IMO it is worth saying what you say is untrue.

The first lot of you question seem around why expose .............. the thin veneer I talk about.

Simple if people start to question the AFL and what they say it helps in the credibility stakes.

I appreciate your comment about the enthusiam and accept that you think this is not an area for a club football forum.

Your last line of: "Is this really how to get sponsors interested in football?" THB no........... but .............. if a message is received by those same sponsors that everything the AFL say and claim is not always correct then as I see it is worth while, Agian I realise we will disagree on this but it is how I see things.

 

[adz]

... you think this is not an area for a club football forum.

Actually I think we (fans) can do a lot to help promote the sport, and we already do. Start by going to games, getting friends to go to games, talking about the games... buy merchandise and wear it around the place so people ask about the team and then you can tell them how good the A-League is and they should go to a game... forums like this discussing the game... you have mentioned ringing up talk back radio and writing to newspapers (although I think that was to say how bad other codes are, rather than talk up... "hype" even... our own).

Simple if people start to question the AFL and what they say it helps in the credibility stakes.

This is the bit I can't get my head around. You are questioning their status of top TV ratings but I can't find that claim anywhere? We cannot deny that AFL is very popular... huge crowds, membership bases. Maybe the TV audiences are lower than NRL because people actually go to the games. NRL "fans" are very fickle and while they say they support a team they will also say they are not a member and they don't go to games... but they might watch a few on TV.

I think of this like a political campaign where the candidates (football codes) can bag the shit out of each other or promote their own policies and strengths. Potential voters (potential fans) are turned off both parties as they only see negative things. Before anyone mentions my hooligans threads, they are meant to be ironic... sockah hooligans calling fans of other sports hooligans... geddit? Also you can have the exact same incident with NRL fans and "soccer" fans and one is a riot and another is boys letting off steam... Meh.

People respond to hype so why not concentrate on getting people excited about football?

 

[adz]

Actually I think we (fans) can do a lot to help promote the sport, and we already do. Start by going to games, getting friends to go to games, talking about the games... buy merchandise and wear it around the place so people ask about the team and then you can tell them how good the A-League is and they should go to a game... forums like this discussing the game... you have mentioned ringing up talk back radio and writing to newspapers (although I think that was to say how bad other codes are, rather than talk up... "hype" even... our own).

adding some more things... talking up rivalries like us vs. Newcastle. Some people might get the shits about this but it gives the media something to focus on and talk about, and that gets people talking about the game more, wondering what the hype is about and most importantly going to the game. Also things that are out of our hands like the AFL (and NRL now) has had huge success with themed rounds - rivalry round, heritage round - and rounds based on certain events like ANZAC day, Queens birthday. They promote the shit out of these too and have much success

 

[midfielder]

ADZ

We have got no arguments all the things you suggested are true and I cannot understand how you can interpret my post in any way says not to do or the only thing to do is attack the AFL. In fact I fully support going to matches, wearing clubs colours talking up local derbies .

ADZ .......... when anywhere did I say football was not popular in fact I said just the opposite... I said "The AFL is undoubtedly the most professionally run best connected sport in Australia, it has the biggest media deal, the most free to air, the biggest crowds. The best media, the most profitable. " How is that in any way not saying the same thing as your comment "We cannot deny that AFL is very popular... huge crowds, membership bases"

Its getting a bit circular now...............its simple............as I see it................ and remember ....... I am reacting .............. to the AFL comments .......... not attacking them.

Remembering as I said I have no idea why the AFL said what they did.......... but they did.

If they attack us ........... then we are entitled to ask questions......... and fight backyou disagree .OK lets move on

I will find the references you want and post in a couple of days as they are last year in AFL media in Melbourne, and work calls at now.

But give me a break if I cant ask this kinda of question on my own teams football forum.. then where do I ask such things.

 

[dibo]

on twgf? 

nobody's saying don't ask the question, but on the flipside don't complain if people don't agree with your answer (or understand it...).

 

[adz]

....... I am reacting .............. to the AFL comments .........
....no idea why the AFL said what they did..........
....If they attack us ...........

I will find the references you want and post in a couple of days as they are last year in AFL media in Melbourne, and work calls at now.

That would be great because I think this is where the confusion lies! You are referring to something the AFL said or did but have no links or even mention of what it is that is getting you so fired up.

All I see is "AFL is over hyped.... and popular.... and must be stopped..."

Huh?

But give me a break if I cant ask this kinda of question on my own teams football forum.. then where do I ask such things.

That's the good thing about this forum, you CAN ask questions like this, and open a debate, but if everyone had the same opinion it would be kind of boring don't you think?

 

[marinersman]

I actually agree with midfielder on this topic and I love the passion he's showing.

It seems to me he is saying that the AFL have done a brilliant job at self promotion and good luck to them for doing it. They have every right and have a lot to crow about. They come from a position of strength. It's a bit like being the government of the day, everything you do and say gets covered in minute detail and you have the availability to refute the opposition's and media's claim. So what you are trying to do becomes self-fulfilling and ultimately positively promoted whilst the opposition come off looking like whinging no hopers.

AFL and Football is a bit like this.

Just remember back to the (in)famous (depending on your point of view) situation a few years ago at the Iran WC qualifier when there was the AFL box at the MCG cheering on Iran. Now those media reports might be slightly embellished, but it sounds about right to me. They are rightly or wrongly slightly (if not more) paranoid about us than any other sport. I remember Ron Barrassi (sp) about the same time saying Football was the greatest threat to AFL in Australia. I don't see any Football offiicial singling out AFL like this.

At the end of the day, both sports will co-exist, that is stating the obvious.

The way I read this thread is that midfielder is saying is, don't let the bastards spead their half truths and I agree with him.

Unfortunately, your average Australian reads News Ltd papers and believes every word written, so why stay silent and not correct their claims and be self-promoting? You can talk all you like about letting HAL and NT team attendances do all the talking you like. The fact of the matter is, our sport is exclusively on pay tele and not yet reaching the hearts and minds of your average, dumbed downed, McMansion living, SS Commodore driving Australian. When we get them, we become second in popularity to AFL and then the can really justify their paranoia.

It's not about attacking AFL or any other sport. It's about promoting and supporting our beautiful game. I am historically sick of being laughed and ridiculed anddismissed for having "wogball" as the sport I love like nothing else.

I think some of you guys are completely missing midfielder's point. I'm with midfielder 100% on this.

 

[dibo]

I think some of you guys are completely missing midfielder's point. I'm with midfielder 100% on this.

he's less than clear on what he wants - if you can understand it, can you translsate for the rest of us?

 

[Arabmariner]

Our game could learn a lot from what the AFL has done.Less than 20 years ago it was still just a victorian comp played at run down old suburban grounds.Crowds and tv revenue were light years away from where they are now.
They have a lot to boast about and we could learn a lot from them.

 

[dibo]

Our game could learn a lot from what the AFL has done.Less than 20 years ago it was still just a victorian comp played at run down old suburban grounds.Crowds and tv revenue were light years away from where they are now.
They have a lot to boast about and we could learn a lot from them.

i think that's more where i'm at too - we could also learn a shitload from both rugby league and rugby union about how not to manage things.

 

[Arabmariner]

Our game could learn a lot from what the AFL has done.Less than 20 years ago it was still just a victorian comp played at run down old suburban grounds.Crowds and tv revenue were light years away from where they are now.
They have a lot to boast about and we could learn a lot from them.

i think that's more where i'm at too - we could also learn a shitload from both rugby league and rugby union about how not to manage things.

I agree with that as well.Union in particular just stumbles from one f@#k up to another.

AFL wouldn,t have been any bigger than NRL in terms of crowds etc 20 years ago.Now a small crowd for them is 25,000 which is a top crowd in the NRL.

I don,t think we need to worry about any of them to be honest.We are also light years away from where we were even 5 years ago.

 

[adz]

I give up... nearly...

I might agree with midfielder 100% too but he hasn't presented his full case. Talking about all these false claims but no actual references to any of them, e.g. the TV ratings thing - when did they say they top the TV ratings? If they say this stuff so often why can't you find one piece of evidence?

The only thing you have mentioned that they are actually hyping up is the 150 years of Aussie Rules:

The 150 year of AFL when if fact if anything it would have been a rugby game of some sort. Even heard A D on offsiders today saying a new club playing one of the 150 year clubs ,,,,,,,,,,,, errrrrrrrr vomit it was a rugby match for F sake

This is a laugh! They make no secret that the game started as a modified version of rugby, and evolved into the game people watch on TV today... well... not many people watch on TV today apparently. What if I told you Australia isn't 200+ years old because it was colonised by Britain in 1788 ,,,,,,,,,,,, errrrrrrrr vomit it was Britain for F sake


If you're going to be exposing all these lies, at least have an example of the offending statement/hype, and then come up with some credible proof against it, rather than some randomly manipulated numbers that looks like you're trying to promote how good NRL is...